Very interested in ThunderGull

[derbaier]

A while back, a guy flew into our club's airfield, where I currently
fly a Challenger-1, in a ThunderGull J. That plane really caught my
eye, and I talked to the owner for quite some time about it. Then I
read every message on this list, and ordered the info package and the
video from EarthStar. The package arrived last week, and next week I
will be going to Santa Margarita for a factory visit. The Gull2K is
everything I would like to have in my next plane, but the allure of 2
seats in the Odyssey is also very interesting. I guess the factory
visit will help me make up my mind which I like best. After the
terrific performance of the Gull2K, the other thing that interests me
is the possibility of being able to store it in my garage, or a
trailer, instead of a hanger. Hangers are pretty hard to come by
here in San Diego. I rent one from a friend right now, but that is
not something that I can count on in the long term. I am wondering if
anyone else on this list stores their plane in a garage or trailer?
Is the wing really as easy to remove/install as it looks like in the
video? I have a lot of other questions about the ThunderGull, but I
hope many of those will probably be answered when visit Santa
Margarita.

Thanks for any info from the list!

--Dave

[Willy]

Hi Dave ,

Sorry I can't respond with much information as
I am in your category: very interested in the
ThunderGull . I took a ride in the Odyssey and
loved it. Also anticipating the lack of a hanger
I asked Mark about the detriments of leaving the
little jewel tied down in the elements. He feels
that it would faire no worse than a Cessna, i.e.
it should hold up fine.

I really appreciate Marks' low key presentation
(he is no car salesman), but I find myself wishing
Earthstar to be just a little higher profile. I
did very simply ask him if his enterprise is in
good shape, if he expects to stay in business, and
he assured me that Earthstar is staying on that mountain.
It is a great site, definitely a great place to visit---kind
of a boys' dream really.

I would love to hear from any builders regarding factory
support: phone calls etc. And though I can see why everyone
is so enthusiastic about the Gull, are there any shortcomings?
How about rough field landings? Marks' sloped mountain top
strip makes a pretty good case for off pavement landings,
but I wonder about ground clearance and small tires.

Dave, please give some feedback after your visit.

Willy

[Jim C]

Dave,

I use to fly a CHII prior to getting my Gull 2K - I don't think I
would ever go back - There isn't any comparison in performance. I
don't know if its that easy to take the wing off or not - Have Mark
show you when you visit his place. The Odyssey is a nice flyer as
well. I am perfectly happy with the Gull 2K though and I really like
the additional width it has. I remember something about a trailer
designed just for the T-gulls - You might ask Mark about it when you
check on how easy it is to assemble and disassemble the plane on a
continuous basis.

Jim C

[derbaier]

That was one of the things that attracted me too. Reading about
all the long distance flying some people on this list have done
made me very envious. I don't find distances over about 1.5 hours
very comfortable right now, partly because my cockpit is so narrow.
My left leg touches the throttle, and my right leg touches the
elevator trim, and my legs still limit aileron control. I may be
making sound more severe than it is, but it is not real comfortable.

Thank you, Jim! I will be certain to add this to my list of
questions. I am not yet certain that I will be trying to have
the Gull live out of my home garage, but maintence would sure
be easier that way. The hanger that I am renting from my friend
is a temporary arrangement for him, and the hanger is 50 miles
from my home.

Thanks again!
--Dave

[derbaier]

Thanks Jerry!

I think that your reasoning regarding 1 seat versus 2 is pretty much
in line with what I have been thinking too. I can also understand
your reasoning regarding hangering versus a trailer. However, my
current situation is a hanger 50 miles away, that I have no guarantee
of being able to keep. What got me started on this trailering kick,
was the wing removal sequence in the promo video, and then hearing
about a Titan owner here who had rigged a built in wing handling boom
into his trailer. That made wing handling pretty safe and
convenient, although wind would be a factor in that case too. The
attraction of trailering, is that the plane would be close to home
for maintenance work, instead of 50 miles away where even minor
maintenance requires a bit of planning to complete successfully.
I have not heard back from anyone on this list that is actually using
the quick wing removal feature that Mark built into the ThunderGull,
so I have to assume that you are pretty close to the mark when you
say that it is not very practical for routine use. It is still a very
interesting idea to me, if I could ever make it work out?

Thanks again!
--Dave

[Jay]

The 2nd seat is my storage area for overnight camping
storage. I would have a tuff time storing all my stuff
in my single seat.

Jay

[derbaier]

I have read of Mark and others making cross country trips in the
Gull2K, while carrying tents, sleeping bags, and other stuff. I have
only seen the ThunderGull J, and it sure *looked* like it could carry
MUCH more than my C1. I'm sure that having that extra seat space
must be very helpful in providing more storage, but is it really
*possible* to carry enough stuff for fly-in camping in a Gull2K? I
really like the idea of the 20 foot wing on the 2K, since that would
make for higher wing loading and a smoother ride, not to mention the
easier storage between flights?

Thanks Jay!

--Dave

[Ron Carroll]

According to Mark the J-Model uses the same cage
as the 2-place. That means that the space behind
the pilot's seat is as large as the 2-place, capable
of carrying tons of camping gear, and an extra 10 gallons
of fuel. The big difference is the J has no door for access
to the rear. Everything must go in over the top/rear of
the pilot's seat. Possibly a door can be copied from the 2-place???

Also, I don't believe the 2K has much, if any, baggage area.
The whole cage has been shortened, and the only thing behind
the seat is for the fuel tank. None for camping gear.
Correct me if I'm wrong Jim.

Ron

[Ron Carroll]

PS - I'm not sure that Mark does his airshow
circuit in a 2K. I know that I've seen him
with the Odyssey with enough stuff to last a month.

Ron

[Jim C]

...... Ron says:

> Also, I don't believe the 2K has much, if any, baggage area. The
> whole cage has been shortened, and the only thing behind the seat
> is for the fuel tank. None for camping gear. Correct me if I'm
> wrong Jim.

...... Dave says:

> I have read of Mark and others making cross country trips in the
> Gull2K, while carrying tents, sleeping bags, and other stuff.


...... Jim says:

Well now, the answer is kind of yes and mostly no. I have flown my
Gull coast to coast - California (from Marks) to Florida (where I
live), and I attend quite a few fly-ins in camping style so I would
disagree that there is not enough room to put things in - I even met
Jay at Lucedale one weekend in Mississippi. It does not have the
space of the J lengthwise or the convenience of the 2nd seat, and you
do have to use the spaces in the 2K more frivilously, but there is
plenty to do the weekend thingy and of course I managed to do the
cross-the-country thingy as well. (you can read my California to
Florida trip back in the Feb 2002 section I think (its a 'no subject'
post anyway).

Anyway on that trip I wrote "... We put in the plane a small tool kit
I had brought with me which also included extra batteries and various
charging apparatus's for the cell phone and handheld radio, a
sleeping bag and pillow, my full set of WAC charts and organizer, 8
bottles of water, 1 liter of Gatorade, some snacks, my tie down bag,
my laptop computer, a medium duffle size bag of clothes, along with
my pilot gear, cell phone, extra handheld radio, full roll of paper
towels and a couple of other odds and ends. Surprise, although I was
not planning to use these items on this trip, there was enough room
for me to have brought along my tent, pad for the sleeping bag, and a
small fold up chair. Single seat and plenty of storage was a plus
for me. Now I had heard of some concern for storage on the single
place Gull 2000 model, but I no longer concur with that analysis and
now wonder how much of that was just plain hearsay. I have to admit
that I did not see how it would all fit in at first, much less with
room to spare, but once being shown by Mark, I now have it down ..."

Now, since then I usually carry with me on my normal 2-4 day trips
the following now. Maps, Flight gear bag (includes GPS, phone,
emergency first aid kit & gizmo's, camera, headset which I wear in
flight, writng stuff, etc), small clothes bag and shavng kit, tent,
sleeping pad, sleeping bag, poncho, tools, engine cover, cockpit
cover, tiedown stuff, and usually a couple of bottles of water or
gatorade and some munchie's, and then I still have some room for some
knick knacks (i.e. bug spray, sun screen, paper towels, WD-40 or
whatever, etc). If I am going really long distance I also carry my
laptop computer which has all my charts electronically on it. With
all of this stuff I am usually still pretty comfortable as well.

Now, of course, if I know someone enroute or a place to stay other
than in a tent, I can can some of this stuff.

Jim C